Chapter 15: Q&A / Discussions

[Brian]

I'll post Melethos's turn when I get into work, later this morning. But I wanted to make sure everyone knows what Big Red knows and doesn't know, as this will influence his decision.

What Melethos knows:

• The dragon turtle wants its egg.
• The nycaloth has the egg.
• He is waiting for the nycaloth to reappear.
• He didn't see the nycaloth reappear this round.
• His friends are dying.
• If the dragon turtle hits them with another breath attack, some will likely die.

What Melethos doesn't know:

• He does not know about the eggs on the beach, so he will act based on that.

[Jeff]

Jun 26, 2018 8:35:53 GMT -4 Brian said:

Scrambling, knowing what he plans would be seen as insane (and rightly so), he makes for the dragon turtle's neck. Green scales cover its vulnerable flesh. Nevertheless, Melethos chops savagely at the dragon, attempting to draw its lethal attention away from his friends and onto him.

_______________________________

Movement: Not sure on this, since the dragon turtle takes up so much space, but Melethos will move near the head of the thing.

Action: Two melee attacks against the dragon turtle.

Melethos:1D20+9 → 16(7 + 9)#first attack on the dragon turtle
Melethos uses his one remaining Superiority Die for a Precision Attack Maneuver.
Melethos:1D10 → 4(4)#Precision Attack Maneuver That's makes this a 20 for hitting purposes
Melethos:1D8+5 → 13(8 + 5)#Damage from the first attack

Melethos:1D20+9 → 15(6 + 9)#second attack on the dragon turtle
Melethos:1D8+5 → 12(7 + 5)#Damage from second attack

Brian, per the Climb Onto a Bigger Creature mechanics in the PHB (on the Quickstats tab), moving around on the dragon turtle is simply difficult terrain. And you have advantage on attacks against the dragon turtle. But given the physiology of the thing, it's correct that you'd need to move toward the neck and head to do get that advantage, since hitting it at the top of the shell shouldn't really grant any advantage as that's where she's the most defensible.

So if you want to add a second roll to each attack (to account for having advantage), go for it.

[Joe]

Jun 25, 2018 21:44:04 GMT -4 Ken said:

Joe: I'm very curious as to why no action from Streko this round? The party is in dire straits, so inaction seems an unusual choice.

It is unclear as to whether or not Streko hears anything. His primary goal is to keep the nycaloth from reappearing, which means he cannot break concentration. Most of Streko's spells require concentration, some don't and those are not helpful.

From his perspective, the only spellcaster was booted off the turtle and the turtle is the LAST thing Streko wants attention from, until, at least, the nycaloth is banished for good.


What Streko knows:

The dragon turtle is pissed off.

The nycaloth is gone.

If he can continue his concentration for a full minute, the nycaloth will NOT reappear, which is a good thing, as he saw no egg and has heard nothing about eggs.

He hears a frog squawk "EGGS," looked around, saw a mound of sand and thought...eggs? Maybe the nycaloth took an egg and if so, is using it as a weapon against us? Asked Kal what he thought.

His friends are dying. They are not even bothering with attempting an escape. They are, in fact, jumping on its back and diving between its jaws. His friends are insane.

If the dragon turtle hits them with another breath attack, some will likely die. Streko has a choice...bring the nycaloth back and face two angry foes (as if the demon will give the egg back if we ask it) and can dragon turtles fly? Streko doesn't know this. Or can he keep his concentration so the demon doesn't come back and his friends can other flee and escape or survive until Streko ends his concentration and brings the demon back.

Streko values Kal's opinions and will not risk a war on two fronts (especially without any facts and just some hunches), so he asked.


What Streko didn't know at the time of his action:

The nycaloth definitely had a turtle egg.

There ARE turtle eggs buried in the sand nearby.

Why his friends thought it was a good idea to run AT the turtle.


Not trying to meta-game. Just stating the facts as I see them, so you better understand what Streko does.

And that is why Streko is doing nothing this round. Without further information, it would be, in his opinion, suicide to do so. Streko doesn't want to die (just yet).


So the question for Jeff is this: With all the roaring and hissing and steam and yelling and such, and with Streko concentrating on keeping a demon on his plane, would he be able to hear what everyone is yelling at him? I, personally, would doubt it, which is why Streko did nothing at that time. Now that things have quieted somewhat, and he sees an egg nearby, he can act, but he saw no such thing as large as that in the demon's hands and if he did, he was busy being attacked by tieflings and bugbears anyway. Hope this clears some things up.

[Ken]

Joe, I absolutely understand that Streko couldn't really hear what was being said about the eggs and why he didn't want to release the nycaloth.

But for Streko to do ... nothing in this situation and to simply stand there, not even declaring a Ready action to cast a spell, is something I don't understand.

[Joe]

I looked at the spells I had available to use and they were either dependent upon concentration (hence the return of the demon), not available via range, or simply not appropriate for the information he had (i.e. focused attention on him...which is NOT what he wanted as it would put both him, Kal and Tangat in jeopardy AND bring back the demon he had just quietly banished, thus pissing him off greatly). Better to reason with the creature we had, than to fight two of them or get caught in the crossfire. Which appears to be working out to some extent, no?

[Jeff]

Jun 26, 2018 21:31:49 GMT -4 Joe said:

What Streko didn't know at the time of his action:

The nycaloth definitely had a turtle egg.

There ARE turtle eggs buried in the sand nearby.

Why his friends thought it was a good idea to run AT the turtle.

Not trying to meta-game. Just stating the facts as I see them, so you better understand what Streko does.

And that is why Streko is doing nothing this round. Without further information, it would be, in his opinion, suicide to do so. Streko doesn't want to die (just yet).

So the question for Jeff is this: With all the roaring and hissing and steam and yelling and such, and with Streko concentrating on keeping a demon on his plane, would he be able to hear what everyone is yelling at him? I, personally, would doubt it, which is why Streko did nothing at that time. Now that things have quieted somewhat, and he sees an egg nearby, he can act, but he saw no such thing as large as that in the demon's hands and if he did, he was busy being attacked by tieflings and bugbears anyway. Hope this clears some things up.

No, I don't think he'd hear everything. But there's also been a lot of shouting, about eggs, meant for everyone to hear.

It's up to you what conclusions you draw from the information provided. Streko was in the same part of the map as everyone when the nycaloth first appeared, holding something: ashlock.proboards.com/post/34558/thread

[Jeff]

We're nearly at 24 for you, Dave. Adamant will take the Dodge action by default pretty soon, okay?

[Dave W.]

Sorry, been crazy

[Ken]

Hey, Jeff -- just to confirm: The dragon turtle's action has fallen between Melethos' and Belarin's turns, right?

[Jeff]

Yes, correct. Sorry, I keep neglecting to include it in the initiative lists. It's there now in my last post.

Darren: Just so we're clear, Kal's consent to Streko—is that taking place immediately (as in a brief off-turn reply), in which case Streko's Readied action takes place right now, before the bugbears and Shorak and eventually Kal go, or are you waiting until Kal's actual turn?

[Darren]

Errr....I guess I would say let's wait until Kal's turn. I'd rather everyone see the egg coming their way before the nycaloth comes back so that they know to target him.

[Jeff]

Since this thread is the more fitting place to address this:

Jun 29, 2018 22:38:16 GMT -4 Darren said:

Jeff, because I get confused by the diagonal thing, can you help me figure something out?

If Kal uses Lightning Shift, he can move 60' this turn. The range of Telekinesis is 60'. Can Kal get within range of the nycaloth to attempt to grapple him with Telekinesis this turn?

It can be confusing. I'm making up a diagonal chart to help measure. Here it is applied to Kal's position:

[Darren]

Oops...posted my question in the wrong area somehow. Sorry!

Okay, that's what I figured, but I wanted to be sure. Thanks!

[Brian]

Question fo Jeff: When the nycaloth took that one point of fire damage, did it dispel any of the Mirror Images, or did it automatically hit the demon?

Also, if Nicky is grappled by the "net," will the Mirror Images also be grappled, or would the net negate the benefit of having those other images? In other words, can Melethos tell which image is the real nycaloth? He would ideally like to try and disarm the demon into releasing the egg, but not if Big Red doesn't have a 100% chance of knowing which image is the real demon.

[Jeff]

No, the fire damage was a secondary effect, not an attack in itself.

The Mirror Images also only matter against attacks (grapple or disarm attacks included), just not on saving throws he is forced to make. Note that he has the egg in two hands as well, so he has advantage on his check against being disarmed.

[Dave W.]

Well done Brian!

Adamant will help with the lighting when he gets a bit closer... he still has the Delvers Light going

[Darren]

Jeff, does using Quickened Spell apply only to new castings? In other words, could Kal use Telekinesis on his turn to move the egg away from the nycaloth, then use Quickened Spell to use Telekinesis again on the nycaloth in the same turn?

[Jeff]

Yeah, only to additional castings apply. Quickened Spell won’t hasten or duplicate the effects of an existing spell, just allow you to, say, fire off a second (non-concentration) spell as a bonus action while you continue using your action to use Telekinesis.

[Dave W.]

Hey you know in Rolz there are dice codes for Advantage/Disadvantage... like if you want to roll Advantage and have a +4 modifier, you tell Rolz to roll 2d20 and take the High 1 then add +4... like this:

#2D20H1 +4

It looks like this:

dlw32:2D20H1 +4 → 23(high 1 of 15; 19 = 19 + 4)#Advantage Test

Disadvantage is the same but instead of H1, you're looking for Low 1. So the same d20 +4 with disadvantage looks like this:

#2D20L1 +4

and generates:

dlw32:2D20L1 +4 → 8(low 1 of 4; 13 = 4 + 4)#Disadvantage Test


PS: Sorry for the junk in the DE Rolz room... I wanted to make sure I had a good example...

[Jeff]

You totally lost me. Sounds like the kind of thing easier to explain in person.

When I have to do advantage or disadavantage I just do #repeat 2 d20+[whatever] so two rolls are made in one line.

[Dave W.]

Both work, there's only a very slim difference. I'm not sure it matters that much but for the record:

#repeat 2 d20+[whatever] will show both rolls, then you read both results and pick the which is higher or lower for the answer.

The advantage of #2d20H1 or #2d20L1 is that it though it still shows both rolls in the parentheses, it also tell you which one is Higher or Lower. It shows the answer.

For example:
#repeat 2 d20+4
dlw32: repeat 2D20+4 → 8; 20(4 + 4);(16 + 4)#test

dlw32:2D20H1 +4 → 22(high 1 of 13; 18 = 18 + 4)#test

So #repeat shows the answer is either 8 or 20. And it shows that you rolled a 4 and a 16. Both rolls are presented and you can pick the one you like.

H1 show you that the answer is 22. It still shows the details that you rolled a 13 and an 18 but then Rolz picked the higher one and applied the +4.

YMMV, but repeat seems better for "I make two identical attacks, but both count" than "I need the higher of two rolls, but only one counts".

---

Bonus to blow your mind, two attack rolls both with advantage (#repeat 2 2d20H1+4):

dlw32: repeat2 2D20H1 +4 → 10; 19(high 1 of 1; 6 = 6 + 4);(high 1 of 15; 8 = 15 + 4)#test



Really Repeat 2 and H1/L1 are effectively the same... 

[Jeff]

I appreciate the effort. My brain is so maxed out these days, that the extra effort to learn that formula just so it can tell me which is the "right" number seems not quite worth it for me. Either way, I prefer to post both numbers in an advantage/disadvantage situation, which my formula makes easier to do. It's not just the outcome I'm looking for, it's the roll results, you know?

Jul 2, 2018 14:27:19 GMT -4 Brian said:

Action: Melethos will use his first action to attempt to grapple the demon.

Melethos:1D20+4 → 24(20 + 4)#grapple attempt against the demon

He will use his second attack to stab at Nicky.

Hah. Didn't Belarin only JUST start saying Nicky (presumably for Nyca—) like just a few pages back? I guess it really took.

[Ken]

Yep. Belarin HAD been saying "Stupid" often, but "Nicky" is brand new as of a couple of weeks ago. I'm glad it's a hit!

[Darren]

It's just easier to say.

Also, I think Belarin is the only one who has said it in-character, so we're all being good about that.

[Jeff]

The contrast between Adamant’s and Thul’s reactions is hilarious.

[Dave W.]

Jul 3, 2018 16:35:47 GMT -4 Jeff said:

The contrast between Adamant’s and Thul’s reactions is hilarious.

Well Thul’s a funny guy...

[Elvis]

Holy Damage!

Nicely done Dave!

[Ken]

Brian, that was a great move, grappling the nycaloth and dragging him (!!!) toward Adamant. Very cinematic!

[Elvis]

I figured he was heading back to the guardian...

[Dave W.]

Yeah, Brian... the disarming of the egg and the grapple... well done!!

I have to say this was an emotional victory... it’s been bugging Adamant for a long time that we set the thing free... he’s going to need a minute here...