Chapter 14: Q&A / Discussions

[Jeff]

Sept 23, 2017 22:48:27 GMT -4 Darren said:

Kal will move 10' forward (2 squares south). That should allow him to see the ledge. He will then cast Wall of Fire. It will start 2 squares SE of the southern-most claw soldier and then go diagonally NW for 60 feet. That should put it right through those 3 soldiers on the southern side and just miss the one on the north side. Hot side will be towards the enemies, so it at least traps the northern one between the wall and the ledge, so next turn he'll have to....I dunno....burn to death. Kal will also make the wall 20' tall, so it should also extend 10' above the bridge blocking line of sight.

Those three soldiers have to make a Dexterity save or take 5d8 damage. They take half on a successful save. I never remember if you want me to roll that damage or if you roll it and if it's rolled individually for each one, so I went ahead and rolled once. Damage is 24.

As a reminder, anyone who ends his turn within 10 feet of the hot side of the wall (sorry Elvis) or who crosses the wall on their turn takes 5d8 fire damage.


After casting, Kal will continue his move and go 3 squares north and one east, putting him behind Streko (and using Adamant for cover). (I had to look it up in the PHB to confirm that you could put your action in the middle of your movement, but it does say that you can do that.)

FYI, per this mention, a diagonal 60-ft. line would be 9 diagonal squares, not 12. You know this and are okay with this? It kind of wouldn't matter even if it was 12 squares long, because a Wall of Fire can only be on a solid surface, and at the northwestern end of it, that solid surface drops off anyway.

I've made it 9 squares long instead of 8 (55 ft. that would be) just to round it off.

Click this to see what I mean:

[Darren]

Yes, that's fine. Thank you.

No, Elvis, no check needed for Thul. Only people who are standing in it when it shoes up.

[Jeff]

Elvis, do note that while grappled you can still do other things outside of moving, like making attacks as normal. But to break free, either your enemy has to go down or you have to use up your action to make the Strength (Athletics) check to try and force yourself free.

[Darren]

A few things:

- Elvis, if you can, Thul is going to want to move on his turn or he'll take damage from the wall (unless Kal fails his saving throw).
- Jeff, based on the graphic you showed above, the ghoul attacking Thul (#3) is still within 10' of the wall at the end of its turn, so it will also take damage, and since he appeared to go before the fireball was cast, I imagine the saving throw shouldn't have any impact on that.
- I'm not sure how Ghoul #1 got where he is (it's not in your action break down), but to regardless, to get there he would have had to cross the wall so he should have also taken damage from that.

[Elvis]

I'm taking fire damage no matter what. If the ghoul takes it, then it's worth the grief. That spellcaster is going to be trouble if I don't get in it's face and keep it attention focused on Thul.

[Jeff]

Sept 24, 2017 17:43:17 GMT -4 Darren said:

A few things:

- Elvis, if you can, Thul is going to want to move on his turn or he'll take damage from the wall (unless Kal fails his saving throw).
- Jeff, based on the graphic you showed above, the ghoul attacking Thul (#3) is still within 10' of the wall at the end of its turn, so it will also take damage, and since he appeared to go before the fireball was cast, I imagine the saving throw shouldn't have any impact on that.
- I'm not sure how Ghoul #1 got where he is (it's not in your action break down), but to regardless, to get there he would have had to cross the wall so he should have also taken damage from that.

Ghoul #3 is 15 feet from the wall, deliberately, and is holding Thul within the wall's heat, deliberately. See what I mentioned here about diagonals.

Ghoul #1 simply moved (Dodge, aka double-moved), if I didn't call that out (when it comes to move, it gets hard to document every step; but when it's important like attacks and such, I try to show the work). That's why it couldn't attack Belarin this turn. It climbed up, after taking that initial fire damage when the wall appeared. Where are you thinking it passes through the wall of fire a second time? The wall of fire does not pass up and through the bridge.

[Darren]

Sept 24, 2017 21:16:18 GMT -4 Jeff said:

Sept 24, 2017 17:43:17 GMT -4 Darren said:

A few things:

- Elvis, if you can, Thul is going to want to move on his turn or he'll take damage from the wall (unless Kal fails his saving throw).
- Jeff, based on the graphic you showed above, the ghoul attacking Thul (#3) is still within 10' of the wall at the end of its turn, so it will also take damage, and since he appeared to go before the fireball was cast, I imagine the saving throw shouldn't have any impact on that.
- I'm not sure how Ghoul #1 got where he is (it's not in your action break down), but to regardless, to get there he would have had to cross the wall so he should have also taken damage from that.

Ghoul #3 is 15 feet from the wall, deliberately, and is holding Thul within the wall's heat, deliberately. See what I mentioned here about diagonals.

Ghoul #1 simply moved (Dodge, aka double-moved), if I didn't call that out (when it comes to move, it gets hard to document every step; but when it's important like attacks and such, I try to show the work). That's why it couldn't attack Belarin this turn. It climbed up, after taking that initial fire damage when the wall appeared. Where are you thinking it passes through the wall of fire a second time? The wall of fire does not pass up and through the bridge.

I was referencing your picture when I said that the ghoul is 10' from the wall. In your picture, the first square is 5', the second is 10', and the third is 20'. The ghoul is two squares from the wall which, I assume, means 10'. Am I misunderstanding?

Why does the wall not pass up and through the bridge? I'm confused on that part, too, which is why I assumed he had to walk through it. If the wall is 20' high and the ledge is 10' down, why wouldn't the wall extend over the bridge?

[Jeff]

Re: ghoul #3, you're right. For some reason I was measuring from a square one square away. I'll add damage in my next post to him.

As for the flames and the bridge, the fire doesn't pass through solid marble. It's magically generated but it's not spiritual fire. That section of wall is a barrier, a wall. It's part of the terrain, and it's wide and thick and it full blocks those squares. It's not a monster, around whom the fire would certainly still occupy the squares.

[Darren]

I guess I just assumed it followed the line of the ground up to its height, and since the "ground" goes up 10' there that it would follow along. If I'm wrong, that's okay, I just didn't understand.

[Elvis]

On the plus side... The wall of fire has completely dried me up. 😄

[Jeff]

Sept 24, 2017 22:11:21 GMT -4 Darren said:

I guess I just assumed it followed the line of the ground up to its height, and since the "ground" goes up 10' there that it would follow along. If I'm wrong, that's okay, I just didn't understand.

I'd need to draw out a more three-dimensional diagram to properly show you why I think that would be silly. It's not like a line of fire comes dropping down from the sky and settles on the first bit of solid ground it touches. If it did, sure, there'd be a wall of fire on the bridge and none directly under the bridge.

But you were placing the Wall of Fire down on the ledge, a ledge which the bridge goes over ten feet above. The bottom line is that there's perfectly solid ground for the Wall to "take root" on, per the spell description (has to be on ground) so it doesn't make sense that it would start 10 feet above the rest of the wall in just that one spot.

[Darren]

No problem. You're the DM and I defer to your decision. I was legitimately confused, but I accept your ruling.

[Jeff]

Uh-huh.

Anyhoo...

I just realized something mighty about fighter (battle masters) like Melethos. I nosed around to see if I could find any discussion about it, and most people and DMs seem cool with it. It does seem to be within the rules.

Most maneuvers (and it's in the wording) are a decision you can make only after you hit an enemy. (Meaning you don't have to declare the maneuver before rolling; you can wait and make sure you're hitting first.) And that means anytime a battle master rolls a critical hit, you can decide to then use a maneuver which involves superiority dice. And then all those dice are rolled a second time as well.

[Jeff]

Sept 27, 2017 8:38:56 GMT -4 Darren said:

Fire Bolt attack against ghoul #4 is a 15. (Even with a +11, Kal struggles to hit.... *sigh*)

Remind me where +11 is coming from? I know Kal's regular spell attack is +7, and Bless can give him an additional +1d4. But did you roll that? I don't see it on Rolz.

[Darren]

Oh, sorry. I thought Bless was just an automatic +4. I guess I mis-read. Subtract the 4 and I'll roll a 1d4 and update the post.

[Jeff]

Yikes. Come to think of it, how did you handle the Bless d4 previously? In your Dexterity save (vs. fireball) you added a 3, and then another 3 in the concentration check, but I'm not seeing a d4 roll for either.

Regardless, I won't go back and change anything (I hate doing that; it's too overt a fourth-wall-breaker for me).

[Darren]

Those 3's were added for Adamant's aura dealie. I never added anything for Bless on those saves because I forgot about it altogether, so technically those saves would have been 1d4 higher, so it shouldn't affect anything.

[Jeff]

Ahh, okay!

[Dave B.]

Is the spellcaster no longer visible? I don't see him on the map anymore.

[Darren]

Sept 28, 2017 23:50:28 GMT -4 Dave B. said:

Is the spellcaster no longer visible? I don't see him on the map anymore.

I believe none of us have any visibility to him anymore. The last place we knew he was was right at the edge of the wall. Presumably, though, if we can't see him he also can't see us, so unless he continues using general AoE spells, he shouldn't be able to directly target us without moving, and that would mean either climbing up (and potentially ending up getting nailed by the wall) or moving back into the wall, either of which is fine by me.

[Jeff]

Correct. You lost sight of him, so he's not on the map. After casting his last spell, he moved. You don't know where to.

[Jeff]

Darren, don't wait for my response. Kal goes next. You can always provide a contingency.

[Darren]

Sept 29, 2017 21:21:30 GMT -4 Jeff said:

Darren, don't wait for my response. Kal goes next. You can always provide a contingency.

I know. Just didn't have time, yet, today. Working on it now.

[Darren]

Jeff, for purposes of Telekinesis, is the boat under 1000 lbs? Could Kal move it? Or at least pull up the end that is starting to fall off?

[Jeff]

He wouldn't know the precise weight (a rowboat for humans might be about 100 lbs). But it's very thick and solid and dense. And was made for hill giants. You make the judgement. If he's not supporting the full weight, he has a good chance.

[Dave W.]

Oct 2, 2017 13:42:41 GMT -4 Dave W. said:

"I am your wall, Kal."

Addy's version of "I'm your huckleberry."

(a Tombstone reference)

[Darren]

*love*

[Jeff]

Oct 2, 2017 16:02:33 GMT -4 Elvis said:

Taking one level of exhaustion to turn my hits into critical hits

Before anyone gets confused by this, this is a function of one of Thul's items. Wait and see.

[Dave B.]

I am definitely liking the Sharpshooter feat. Especially, when Streko gives Shorak an advantaged attack. +10 damage & Sneak attack. What's not to like?

[Ken]

Very cool!

Hey, Jeff, if Belarin moves back toward his previous spot but doesn't climb up, will he still have line of sight to the remaining manticore?