Chapter 7: Q&A / Discussion

[Ken]

Jeff, would the crates between Belarin and the gnoll archer be considered (in game terms) "difficult terrain" or should they be considered a square higher?

[Jeff]

Oh yes, sorry, I should have mentioned that. Definitely more than difficult terrain. They'd need to be climbed, in fact. Once you've climbed up, then they're difficult terrain to move from one to the other. But if you can climb up the first, the gnoll won't have cover any more.

[Dave W.]

Not to be difficult but doesn't Adamant get an opportunity attack when the gnoll shifts because of Condign's Viper Strike?

[Jeff]

The gnolls had their action first. Then Condign went, and his power states that if that particular gnoll shifts again before Condign's next turn, then Adamant would get the opportunity attack. It hasn't had the opportunity to fulfill that yet, because it's not yet the next round.

[Jeff]

“Time to join your ancestors, foul creature,” the elf says quietly.

Out of curiosity, Mike, when you use orange, do you mean Syrdan's saying this in Elven?

I typically use orange to indicate some language other than Common, so I'm just wondering if you were, too.

[Dave W.]

Dec 9, 2010 21:47:28 GMT -4 Jeff said:

The gnolls had their action first. Then Condign went, and his power states that if that particular gnoll shifts again before Condign's next turn, then Adamant would get the opportunity attack. It hasn't had the opportunity to fulfill that yet, because it's not yet the next round.

I guess I got ahead of myself... HEY!! I've got a sinus infection and I'm taking some serious meds over here! I'm just glad I can still type with my thumbs without the words getting all bendy on me!!!

[Mike]

Dec 9, 2010 21:49:34 GMT -4 Jeff said:

Out of curiosity, Mike, when you use orange, do you mean Syrdan's saying this in Elven?

Yep.

[Mike]

Dec 10, 2010 10:45:47 GMT -4 Darren said:

"Condign! Adamant! We need you over here!" Kal yells out as he backpedals and fires off a streak of electricity.

Tactically speaking, I think the best thing Condign and Adamant could do is stay exactly where they are and finish off the gnolls, before heading over to deal with the troll.

It's the main lesson I've learned about 4E combat - don't spread attacks too much between opponents. Pour damage on a foe, wipe him from the battlefield, then move on. If Adamant or Condign leaves to help out with the troll, that means the gnolls will be hanging out and inflicting damage even longer.

Syrdan's about to (hopefully) make himself a roadblock between Resh and the troll. But Streko, Belarin, Condign, and Adamant should definitely (IMO, anyway) pile on the gnolls before heading over to help fight the troll.

[Jeff]

And don't forget the wiki:

darkechelon.wikispaces.com/Combat

Let me now if that's missing anything. Ken, I seem to recall you pointing out some things to be added, and I don't think I ever got to it...

[Darren]

It wasn't necessarily an out of game suggestion. Put yourself in Kal's shoes, and you'd be yelling for the meat shields, too.

In my mind, Kal was yelling similarly to how Burglecut did when he was chosen to go on the expedition with Willow.

That's right. I made a Willow reference.

[Jeff]

10 points to Griffindor, Darren, for the excellent analogy.

[Mike]

Oh, I wasn't debating whether or not it was the appropriate thing to say in-character. Makes total sense.

Just pointing out the possible strategic drawbacks to that suggestion out-of-character. Which is why I posted it here, rather than having Syrdan say something to Kal.

[Mike]

Jeff, now that I checked the Combat wiki ... did Syrdan's healing include the extra three points from Condign's Inspiring Presence?

[Brian]

Darren, I may be wrong on this but I think an action point allows you to do an additional action--one action--not an entire turn. But it's early and I haven't had coffee yet, so I'll wait for someone more knowledgeable to weigh in.

[Ken]

Channeling the spirit of Ed MacMahon: "You are correct, sir!" It provides one extra action.

[Jeff]

Dec 10, 2010 16:13:24 GMT -4 Mike said:

Jeff, now that I checked the Combat wiki ... did Syrdan's healing include the extra three points from Condign's Inspiring Presence?

No, I'd forgotten that. Thanks. And the extra healing comes from Syrdan's using an action point, not his actual Second Wind use. And that's 5 hit points, not 3. Which I think Syrdan could really use right now.

I've taken care of it.

[Darren]

Oops. I had no idea. Well, then cancel the Lightning Orb (which probably didn't hit, anyway) and Kal will just move away from the immobilized troll.

[Ken]

One more thing to keep in mind, Darren: "Immobilized" doesn't mean paralyzed. Kal may end up provoking an opportunity attack from the troll by striking in melee and then moving away.

[Ken]

Joe wrote:

Streko hears the screams and roars from the other side of the building and grows deeply concerned.

"Belarin, dispatch that gnoll quickly. We must return and aid our friends as quickly as possible. Hopefully, between Adamant and the Teifling, that other gnoll will be taken care of quickly as well. I fear something loathesome has appeared and our friends are in greater danger now than ever! I suggest returning the way we came. Perhaps our appearance will comes as a surprise that we can use to our advantage?"

I'm hoping that Streko can do something on his turn this round to help Belarin achieve the gnoll's immediate death.

[Darren]

That part I did know. I actually went so far as to look it up in the PHB. I still think it's worth keeping the troll stuck in place until we can re-group and face him together. If he got to keep moving forward, at some point he'd pin Syrdan and Kal against the back wall and probably tear Resh to shreds, as well.

[Ken]

Right. I'm hoping that Streko can kill the gnoll this round (since Belarin missed ). The gnoll was bloodied after Belarin did 26 points in one round, and it's taken a lot since then. One more decent hit should do it, if my math is right. The immediate teleport from Warlock's Curse will help Belarin get a head start on heading back down the alley and coming around the corner to get the troll and the goblins in a nice area attack.

But if that gnoll doesn't die, Belarin can't run without it shooting an arrow in his back.

[Darren]

Also, if we can manage to get the troll down that far, Kal does have fire attacks. But they all require him to be close to the troll, and he's not really looking to do that right now.

[Dave W.]

Made a mistake in my post, Addy didn't attack the gnoll or stay adjacent so it's not challenged any more. He did however try to put himself between the group and the troll, so it's not all bad...

[Brian]

Joe. this is two out of the last three rounds where you did not attack. Is there some strategy here that I'm missing?

[Joe]

Yeah...and it's two out of three rouds I didn't make the decision...it was just assumed...and rather than wait for me to be able to post, which I assume everyone knows is once a day, usually around 6 pm Pacific, depending on when I get home, the action moves forward.

For what it's worth, Streko never intended to leave Bealrin hanging there...it was a suggestion to return...and since Belarin would be next to attack, it was assumed he would be ale to finish him off. He's never run away like that previously...just as he's never used his sickle as a first line of offense, but again, that is all neither here nor there. It's done. Those were all my mistakes and I should have stated clearly what actions Streko would make this time around to avoid confusion.

I take full responsibility for this, but I would appreciate it if the action were slowed or stopped until I could post...rather than assume what Streko would do....something which might very easily change depending upon what happens before the next round occurs. I try to post at least once every day. Sorry I can't post throughout the day five or six times and rarely more than twice. The only times I won't post is if there is truly nothing for Streko to do or react to.

I'm only slightly annoyed, mostly at myself for not being more clear. I will endeavor to do so in the future.

[Jeff]

Frustration is frustration and we're all subject to it, whether it's an in-game misunderstanding or a real-life bad day. I don't want to make anything worse, I only want to make sure we're all on the same page.

Joe, no one's asking you to post more than once a day. No one. From day 1 that's all I've ever asked of everyone. And in combat rounds, posting once a day becomes even more important. We don't each post multiples times within each round of combat.

Yeah...and it's two out of three rounds I didn't make the decision...it was just assumed...and rather than wait for me to be able to post, which I assume everyone knows is once a day, usually around 6 pm Pacific, depending on when I get home, the action moves forward.

I'm not sure I follow this part, Joe. Didn't make the decision? No one made a decision for you.

- For rounds 1 and 2, you had Streko just moving.

- For round 3 you posted that Streko was keeping up with Belarin and that "Therendor is ready, should he be needed," so when a goblin appeared to threaten Belarin, I had Streko make an attack against it. Should I not have?

- For round 4, you posted that Streko was using Daunting Light on the goblin, and that worked out spectacularly, not only killing the goblin but catapulting Belarin where he wanted to be with his curse-based teleportation.

- For round 5, you posted that Streko would move behind the nearest crate, so that's what Streko did. No attacks, just a move.

- For round 6, you posted a Lance of Faith attack, so that's what Streko did.

- For round 7, you posted spoken words from Streko. Because I checked with you about that, you told me Streko was heading back the way he came, so that's what Streko did this round.

The main thing—and this goes for everyone—is that it's important that I know when you guys are taking actions. If you don't take actions and just talk, then that's all that's going to happen. Outside of combat, I'm often forced to make assumptions I'd rather not; a lot of times you guys talk to each other and say what you plan on doing but it's rarely acted upon. So to keep the game moving I just use DM fiat to get you to the place you're talking about.

In any case, it's in combat where this is paramount.

[Dave W.]

If I could just kibitz a bit... The troll is dazed until the end of my next turn. That means he won't be doing opportunity attacks. He also grants combat advantage, so you'll get +2 on attacks.

[Darren]

Good point, Dave. But since Adamant goes last in the initiative order, none of us will be able to take advantage of that until next turn.

Part of the reason I moved Kal forward, besides the opportunity to use fire against the troll, was to hopefully be in position to help drag Syrdan out of the way, or at least cover anyone who was trying to.

[Ken]

A few quick notes, in case I don't get a chance to write a combat post for a couple of hours:

Joe - Thanks for updating yesterday's post! That's a big help, even if the attack missed. Belarin will try to take the attention of the goblins and Rejdar so that Streko can get within range of Syrdan for a healing word or similar thing. Streko still has an action point; this might be a good time to use it, especially with the difficult terrain between you and him, not to mention that if Syrdan misses one more save, he's, um, a Dead Avenger.

Darren - Right now, Kal goes right before Belarin; if he were to go right after Belarin, he'd be in better shape to take advantage of the power that Belarin will hopefully use this round (unless Rejdar gets in the way). So I just want to casually suggest that Kal may want to delay his initiative for a step or two, from 14 to 12. It won't make a difference as far as enemy attacks go.

Mike - DUDE! I'm rooting for you, man! I'll even do my Peri impersonation from Doctor Who (just without the luscious breasts): "Don't die! You can't leave me now!" Great post, great sacrifice.

Dave and Brian - These gnolls suck, don't they?

Jeff - In the last round, Belarin placed his curse on the closest enemy. Would that have been Rejdar? Also, I believe Adamant's position on the map is incorrect, since the troll did swing at him. Could you please correct? Excellent combat recap!

Damn, I'm loving this.

[Jeff]

Ken, I'll let you decide now who you want to be cursed. If you want to teleport around, you're best best is to curse, then kill a goblin. But...Rejdar is the closest.

Map fixed. Thanks.